On and Off the Field

August 02, 2023

Guillermo Andrade, the founder of the celebrated fashion brand 424, has now been named Creative Advisor to the Leagues Cup, a World Cup-style club tournament in its inaugural year that has sparked the interest of football fans across the world.

In celebration of the tournament, which brings North America together through football, Andrade has called upon the talents of the Mexican fashion house Liberal Youth Ministry, and its founder Antonio Zaragoza, to create a capsule collection that seamlessly merges style and sport through the creative eyes of both designers.

Like the tournament itself, where rivalry meets camaraderie, the pieces designed similarly meld the cultures of Mexico, Canada, and the United States.

office sat down with the two designers to not only talk about the tournament and their collaborative collection but their personal relationships with football and the role of the sport in creating unity and purpose.

Interview by Dylan Andrews
Photos courtesy of Leagues Cup

The limited edition capsules and fanwear collections are availabe online at 424, Liberal Youth Ministry, Leagues Cup, and in stadiums.

Guillermo, I saw you're an Arsenal fan.

GA— Correct.

Yeah, I'm a Chelsea fan, so…

GA— Oh, yeah, we got beef.

We got beef for sure.

GA— I mean, I guess, yeah, we're doing all right right now. The truth is I'm a football fan first and foremost, you know so soccer's been like a saving grace in my fucking life, you know what I mean?

In what way has it been a saving grace?

GA— Because if I didn't have that, I'd probably be doing a lot of other bad shit, you know, that a lot of my other friends got into. Just because of soccer, I got to spend a lot of time dreaming, like positive dreams. And that kept me from putting my energy into anything else.

Yeah, I feel that. I feel like anyone that plays football at a young age has that dream of being a professional, no matter how good you are, you look up to those players and it keeps you in line to some extent.

GA— And then when you play and it's going for you, it's like, I'm gonna continue this. And then the homies, they leave you alone, cause “Ah, he plays soccer, leave him alone.” No one cares.

Yeah. I'm guessing that’s the case here more so than a lot of places. Obviously football here is getting bigger and bigger now, which is amazing. But I'm guessing in your younger days it was a lot smaller than it is now.

GA— Yeah, you know, when I think about it, I always felt like the only kid who liked soccer, especially in my group of friends. So when I finally got on a team and I got to play a lot it was really nice, but the opportunities were not really there. You know, I had a scholarship, so I had a chance to be there and to play, but now there's so much more opportunity. There's so many different ways that you can go and take part, and that's really awesome.

Antonio, what about you? Are you a footballer?

AZ— No, no. I suck at football, but I am based in Mexico, Guadalajara, and I'm 100% Mexican. So you cannot escape soccer. And for me, my grandfather used to play it, my father used to play it, my brother used to play it. I tried to play it when I lived in The US for a couple of years, maybe to feel a little bit closer to Mexico. Yeah, but I wasn't good. I'm not really good at playing but it's always there, you know? I grew up playing FIFA with my dad on PlayStation, so you cannot escape from it. It just swallows you and it's just part of the Mexican heritage. And I grew up watching Jorge Campos with these crazy outfits, so it's just something you cannot escape. And so that is super important for the Latin American community. So that's kind of my history with it.

Yeah. I feel like it's such a beautiful thing with Latin football, that even if you don't play, everyone's immersed in the culture, and everyone's so passionate about it. You know, if your team loses, it's a big deal. If your team wins, it's a big deal. Like, you live and breathe it, even if you don't play. Guillermo, you were born in Guatemala. I'm guessing the football culture there is quite big too?

GA— Yeah, I was born in Guatemala. I was like 10 years old when I came to the States. I mean, I don't even really have that many memories from being a kid in Guatemala outside of football, if I'm honest. Most of them are terrible except for the ones I have surrounding football. It's not just a part of the culture. You know, it's like in America they have the American pastime, right? It used to be baseball, and now the popularity of basketball has gotten to a whole ‘nother level. American football has gotten to a whole ‘nother level, and now soccer is taking the center stage. But around the world, I feel that soccer represents hope and for a lot of people who are not born into great situations soccer is a way out.

Whatever it is you're going through, if it's not money problems, it's like mental health, which is super important when you're a kid. Soccer keeps you in a great state of mind, even if you lose, you know, I think the physical activity, the camaraderie, being around people who may or may not like you, learning about life at a young age through the sport, is really a beautiful thing. So I think in third world countries, honestly, in every country I've been to, except America, soccer is like what basketball, football and baseball and hockey and tennis and everything combined is to America. Soccer is that to everywhere else, right? Like he said, you just can't escape it because it's like there's Jesus, there's food and then there's football.

Yeah if you have stuff going on in your life, football's such a great way to escape. It's such a healthy way to escape it. I remember in those later teen years, as a lot of kids were, being angry at not much and having a lot of frustration, and then for 90 minutes or however long you play, that goes away and releases.

GA— It's the best feeling ever. Well, scoring a goal actually is like the best feeling ever.

I mean, I played right back for the most part. So, for me, it was making those goal-saving tackles.

GA— You would've hated me (laughs). A goal is the best thing I've ever experienced. Like an important one. You know, when you score an important goal, you send someone home. Oh, man. Oh my God.

there's Jesus, there's food and then there's football.

I wanted to ask about the relationship with football and 424. Is the name a reference to the formation, or is it just a coincidence?

GA— Well, I mean, it depends if you believe in coincidences. The truth is, it's the physical address to my first place of business. We were there for about 10 years, so I always had a particular relationship with buildings that are named after the address. Here in The States, every time you go to a building that's named after the address, it's a government building or something kind of intense, something kind of powerful, you know, usually it means that you're in trouble. And I had a really bad affiliation to any physical spaces named after the address. So I wanted to kind of flip that a little bit. And internally it wasn't even a public thing, or it was just not some angle. It just naturally came to me. I think I also really loved how permanent it feels, you know, to have the name of your work be the address of it. It's a physical space. It exists in the real world outside of the internet. And it's actually very definitive, you know, it's like, it's here, and I just wanted to kind of, put my foot down and say, I'm not going anywhere. You can't deport me. You can't send me back. You can't hate a number. It is kind of like a new start.

It’s cool that's the mentality, because in football, that's obviously quite an attacking formation.

GA— Yeah. It's aggressive, you know.

Aggressive, yeah. So I assumed it was a football thing. That's funny. And the red armbands, is that a reference to the captain's armband, or is that something separate as well?

GA— Again, the armband is the attitude of the best player on the team, right? Usually the leader. And they might not always be the fastest, or the guy who scores the most goals, but he's the guy on the team that you look to when you wanna feel you're a part of something. So, in the same spirit, but in a totally different way, armbands in general have always been a symbol that you belong to something bigger than yourself. And I really like that as a canvas for my first statement as a brand to have that energy. If you feel left out, I see you, I respect you, you know, if you don't have money, I'll give you a fucking armband, put it over your own H&M jacket, it didn't matter because it's not about the money. I grew up loving a bunch of shit that I could never get my hands on for whatever reasons. So an armband really sends the message; “I'm with this group, and I like the camaraderie”, you know, there's a connection between football and the work itself. It's not really football but the spirit of it is. It's not like I'm taking a football kit and putting a ‘424’ on it, and selling it for five, six hundred.

Antonio, can you tell me about Liberal Youth Ministry, how that started, the inspiration behind it, and what it means to you?

AZ— So, I started the brand in 2016. I don't know, it is kind of a cliche, but it was just a way of expressing myself and just doing clothes that I couldn't find anywhere. We are based in Mexico and everything we, or at least 90% of the products we produce are made in Mexico. For the name, my background was really into music. So I think for me, music and punk and grunge were things that kind of helped me going through dark times. And when I was looking for the name of the brand I just wanted something that sounded political, dangerous, like a new way of thinking, or a new way of expressing yourself.I just started to play with something that also sounds a little bit religious but in a little bit of a twisted way.

For the brand, for the past three years, I've been really close to Comme des Garçons and Dover Street Market. They've been capital for the growth of the brand, and I am part of their showroom in Paris. And that's where I think most of the brand operates, like, we produce everything in Mexico and we sell it in Paris. But for the brand, I think it's always changing. It's not like a space without movement. I think in the past, in the first collections, I was really into exploring different subcultures, but at the end it felt a little bit tiring. Like, punk already made its revolution decades ago. So I'm just trying to find new ways to express myself. And right now for me, it's really important to create a mix of what I see in Mexico and, and what I see in the streets and incorporate it into the brand and to the collections.

For example, I think this connects with the football jerseys that I've been doing over the past years. But in 2020, when I went to the first showroom in Paris during Fashion Week, I was like, ‘oh, okay, so now we have this big stage, how can I bring Mexico into it?’ And I didn't want to bring it with a folklore vibe. I wanted to bring Mexico to my collections and that's where I started to find this connection to football. I was really into the aesthetic of Campos and different football players, so I started to design these football jerseys with Mexican slogans because that's something that I felt like can fit into the concept of the brand, but also bring Mexico in a creative way. So from there, these were my most known products. And whenever I do a collection, this is always a top seller. So, I think it's something that is just always changing for me. The brand is always chaotic and colorful, and it's something that I think also represents Mexico.

You cannot escape color. Like when you're in Mexico, you see the clashes of different things together. The clashes of reference when you go to a flea market, you see anime, but then you see cowboy boots, but then you see tropicalized Nike. So I think all of these concepts and things go into my brand, and also the rock scene is super powerful. When The Cure or big, big bands come to Mexico it is always sold out. So I think it's just a mixture of all these things that create a brand. And it's… it's Mexico.

Yeah. How did the two of you begin working together? Did you have an existing relationship beforehand?

GA— No, I was just a fan, man. I mean, we're in the scene and there's so few other names that sound like mine or that ring familiar. So you start to recognize each other in the room, you know, or even just by name. I always kept up with his work and found ways to include it in stuff that I was a part of. And when I got this job he was my first call. And we haven't looked back since.

So Antonio was someone you always wanted to work with, but you were just waiting for that right project?

GA— Yeah, of course. Well actually if I'm honest, I was a little intimidated (laughs), you know, so I was like, ‘well, I better come correct. I gotta bring something good, or else what the fuck's the point?’ So then I was like, ‘yo, you're gonna want to hear this.'

AZ— I think from my side, I’ve known Guillermo's work for a long time so we always tend to gravitate closer to each other as friends, but we never found, like he said, a project to work with. And to be honest, from the first call that he's talking about, it was like a couple months ago, it was like instant chemistry. And then I finally had the chance to meet him in Los Angeles three weeks ago. And it felt like he was a brother from the beginning, it wasn't this weird corporation chemistry like you are trying to just have fun from the beginning. It's been a dream come true to be working with him. And it's just super fun because we know each other's languages, like the other day he was wearing this super cool 424 grunge shirt, made out of silk. You know, he's Latin American, and likes football. So it just makes a lot of sense to be working on this project together.

I wanted to talk about the first Leagues Cup tournament and the importance of a competition that brings the whole of North America together.

GA— I think just the fact that it's happening is already quite a big deal. I mean, three countries taking their league and then playing a World Cup style tournament against each other is kind of unheard of. And then the MLS are doing their bit to make sure that the Premier League isn't the only league that's watched in the world. And they're creating a full blown community that's going to be watched all over the world. I mean, you look at what happened the other day in Miami, you know, Messi's first game was a Leagues Cup in a sort of inaugural game. And I would argue that probably the whole world watched that game.

And of course he scored too, he just had to.

GA— It was written, bro. I think that the Leagues Cup is an announcement that soccer's here, soccer's here in The States and it's not going anywhere.

It's super exciting for me moving here. Western Australia, where I grew up and Bermuda, where I'm originally from both have strong footballing cultures. So to see it growing here, now that I live here, is just super exciting.

GA— Right. I know, it's nuts. An, the two most important leagues in Central and North America coming together, dude, and doing this, if I was a kid, I would've been all over it. It's like a World Cup every July. So as the teams progress and the games get better and there's more support for the game here, the tournament will only grow and grow. So this is a great new step. You know when they did the Super League and they just cherry picked all the teams, you know, it feels a little bit more inclusive. It feels a little bit more thought out. Yeah, and from my experience so far, it's still about the game. It's still about promoting the game and growing the game, and that feels good.

It's still about promoting the game and growing the game, and that feels good.

I mean, it's amazing for the MLS of course as it's getting bigger. But I feel like, especially for Mexican football, where there's so much talent, particularly a lot that play in MLS. I think that'll start bringing more attention to that as well, which is amazing.

GA— It's a new beginning, you know? Iit is a new beginning. And even with the Leagues Cup hiring me and giving me the resources to go and work with people like Antonio and to take on the initiatives that we're doing and to try and do something cool as a tournament, that's a big step too. That doesn't usually happen. It hasn't happened, not on this level. So I think that shows the intent for it to be on and off the pitch so that the growth is not only about selling tickets.

AZ— From my side, what my mind and my body reads about this is just so beautiful because, I think in a world that has a tendency for hate and to separate things, I think this league really creates a manifest of joy and coming together, you know. Like Mexico and The US and Canada, the way it looks in the photos that I've been watching over the weekend about the celebration of it. And for me as a Mexican to know that your people in different parts of The US would have a chance to see their football teams that they haven't seen for 20, 25, 30 years because they have something political or they cannot come to Mexico. And for them to see their team is just beautiful to watch. And it's something I think is really inspiring and something that is just beautiful to see. For example, in the game that we just watched with Messi, people from Argentina were flying to the US and just celebrating the sport. I think it's necessary.

Yeah, it's beautiful. It's definitely just further proof that football brings people together. Its so nice to see.

GA— Hell yeah, it does. It's gonna be sick. It's gonna be sick. It's about soccer and its impact on people beyond the game, you know, people who don't make it as pros, because I still love the game. It gave me everything. And I’m grateful to give back. That's kind of it.

Sport

SATISFY Unveils a New Short Film

March 22, 2024

The War on Drugs on replay, a sunny Los Angeles afternoon, what more could you want? SATISFY's new film featuring Pro Athlete Matt Lenehan is a love letter to running and L. Running isn't always about performance. For many, especially in a city like Los Angeles where you're driving most of the time, it's a way to slow down the pace. Creative Director Brice Partouche found keen collaborators in filmmakers David & Douglas who share a love for LA's unique culture, culminating in a video that turns your attention away from your screen to being on the move.

“We want our community to take a moment and watch, shut down their screens, and hit the road or trail” says Brice Partouche. “Like watching a skateboard video and then feeling the urge to grab your board. We want the film to bring out the spirit of Los Angeles and the true essence of running, inspiring people to get out there and experience it for themselves.”

Watch the video below.

Film created by David&Douglas

Sport

Revamping the Cavs with Daniel Arsham

February 12, 2024

As I walked out of the Barclays Center after a Cleveland Cavaliers win, a group of midwesterners attempted to take my custom Daniel Arsham Cavs varsity jacket. They then proceeded to insist on buying me drinks. That sums up how lit the night was for Cavs fans.

In 2022, Arsham, a Cleveland native, recreated the team’s jersey and uniform designs. While he specializes in sculptures and large-scale pieces, the multidisciplinary artist tapped into fashion while intersecting it with his art to embody his love for the city.

With an abundance of food and drinks, artists, influencers, stylists, and journalists gathered in a box suite to celebrate Arsham’s achievements working with his hometown team, as well as the various projects he’s created on his own and with others. Not to mention, the Cavs won. Let’s call it the Arsham Effect.

By Marisa Kalil-Barrino
Photography by Olivia McCausland

Before the frenzy of Brooklyn Nets fans filling up Barclays Center, I sat down with Arsham to discuss the importance of representing his hometown, his vision for revamping the Cavs’ looks, and how he brings it all to life.

How did you feel when you found out that you were creating a team design, especially knowing it’s your hometown?

I'm a third generation Clevelander. My grandparents and father were born there. A lot of it was telling my father that this was gonna happen with a big moment for me. Obviously watching the team throughout my youth and it's sort of being this untouchable thing. Being able to really kind of redirect all the visual aspects of it is part of the reason why I got involved in it. I was discussing a lot with Grant Gilbert. I know him very well. ‘You guys should do this, you guys should do that,’ blah, blah, blah. Eventually it was kind of like, ‘Why don't you come on board and see what you could do in-house with us.’ And at the time, we've seen a lot of creative directors come into the league.Ronnie's doing work for the Knicks now. Don C. has been doing work for the Bulls. But at that time, the design language of The NBA was a totally different design language. We came into it and refined things.

Would you say you're a minimalist when it comes to fashion?

Certainly what I've tried to do with the team on court. I think if you look at our jerseys, some of them don't have edging. They have stripes on them, they're almost tonal in some ways. And I think when you see us on the court in relation to other teams, we look different and the players have told me they love that, you know?

How does your creative process and art intertwine with sports and fashion?

I really don't distinguish between what I'm doing. I just feel like I always try to make things that I want to see exist – whether it's jerseys, artwork, sculptures, or architecture. It's kind of like trying to make something if I feel like I need to or I want to see that in the world. I hope other people do as well.

Is it a pretty cathartic process or does it come to you pretty quickly?

Typically we're working on stuff in the off season. Last summer, we were designing stuff that would be on court. There's no basketball happening during that time. That's the time that I'm thinking, what's the next season going to be like? I mean, the team is playing incredible this season, so it's been amazing to see all the new designs; the city edition jerseys that we did on court.

Is there anything else you would want to create to kind of pay homage to your hometown?

I did a big exhibition in Cleveland, which was my first show there. It opened earlier this year, and that was a really big moment for me. Obviously we connected it with the Cavs and brought some of that energy in. Cleveland is a much smaller city than New York. I think, growing up, the way that I felt about the teams, was almost like an identity. The people there associate so directly with the Browns or the Guardians or the Cavs. But it's really a part of the culture in the city.

Sport

The Future Is Efron: Efron Danzig

December 14, 2023

Although Efron Danzig has only been in New York for a year, the artist, model, pro-skateboarder, musician and poet is already more seasoned than most. After all, she spent the first seven years of her life here, before moving to Philly.

Efron’s presence captures something both difficult to describe and inextricably downtown: a sense of effortlessness, both ethereal and in the moment. A muse for a new generation of New Yorkers seeking authenticity and a sense of self.

photography DANIELLE APHRODITE
interview by PAIGE SILVERIA
styling CAITLAN HICKEY
talent EFRON DANZIG - Midland Agency
hair JOHN NOVOTNY using ORIBE
makeup JEZZ HILL
photo assistant EMLYN MILEAF-PATEL
fashion assistants DYLAN ANDREWS, CASSIE JEKANOSKI
creative producer OLIVIA ROPER-CALDBECK
production assistants ABBY FALZONE, LIV SOLOMON
location 42N STUDIOS

I met Efron initially through Supreme filmmaker Bill Strobeck, who welcomed her into the roster of his new brand and skate team, Violet. Beyond the skate world, Danzig has walked a Marni show, starred in a Calvin Klein campaign, authored a poetry book, and showcased her work with the Daisies series in Paris, Biarritz, New York and Tokyo.

Putting together this 20th anniversary issue with a special focus on New York, Danzig seemed an obvious choice to feature as the exciting and inspiring future of our hometown.

EFRON wears SWEATSHIRT, SKIRT, UNDERWEAR, SHOES by ALEXANDER WANG, SHIRT, SUNGLASSES by BALENCIAGA, BAG by GUCCI

[Originally published in office magazine Issue 20, Fall-Winter 2023. Order your copy here]

Paige Silveria— How are you? What have you been up to?

Efron Danzig— I’m pretty good. I just started barbacking at a burlesque club; it makes me want to perform. I also assisted this photographer Jimi [Franklin] the other day, just trying to learn what I can from him. I met him on a shoot recently. His photos are really soft. [Shows images by the photographer]

PS— Reminds me of The Panic in Needle Park, the coloring and tone.

ED— Yeah I know exactly what you mean. I want to shoot more like that. It’s nice to be learning since I’m not going to school or anything.

PS— I think that’s the way to do it. How long have you been in this apartment?

ED— Since April. I’ve just been subletting it from a friend. It’s fun to have my own apartment. Also cool to have space to make art. I’m about to move spots again soon, but I don’t know where in New York yet.

PS— It feels a bit like being in a Jarmusch apartment. It’s very old New York and cozy, chaotic in a good way.

ED— It’s usually not this messy, but I’ve had a lot of people stay with me over the past two weeks. I need to clean that couch. There are clothes all over my room because I’ve been taking a lot of photos of my friends there. I just end up throwing things around and then leaving for the night. Been taking a lot of self-portraits here too. Just setting up lamps and putting clothes over them to make the lighting certain colors. I’ve been watching a lot of movies and trying to emulate the look. I really love Jim Jarmusch’s films, specifically Night on Earth.

PS— I think you’ve definitely achieved that. Tell me about the self-portraits.

ED— [Showing some images on the computer]. This one I was experimenting with the lighting in the different rooms and the background and trying to see what silhouettes look good. It’s fun to just get high and play dress up. Learn things by trial and error, seeing what works and what doesn’t. I started taking self-portraits out of curiosity. Like, what do I even look like? What happens if I do this? Or that? It’s easy to test things on myself. Here’s photos of this weird dude I saw on the bus and then he played a ukulele on the beach in a cheetah-print speedo.

PS— I love him! Speaking of your trial-and-error navigation, I interviewed this iconic, celebrated photographer who’s in her 70s for a magazine a while back. She was pretty terrifying to speak with actually. But it was interesting to hear that she’d never learned how to properly use her camera. She’d always just winged it and still to this day does.

ED— Like an outsider artist, I’ve always found that really interesting. I have no idea what I’m doing. So it’s fun to just figure shit out or ask my friends for help — I ask them for help a lot. I’m really inspired by so many of my friends here. I feel like I have a lot to learn from them.

PS— Yeah, I find outsider artwork especially intriguing — what people come up with when they aren’t aware of what’s expected, the rules and what’s come before. Tell me about where you grew up.

ED— I was born and lived in New York City until I was seven. Then my parents split. My mom moved to Philadelphia and my dad stayed here. I went back and forth until I was 10. Then I was mostly in and around Philly until last August, when I moved back to New York, a year ago around this time.

PS— Were you always so creative?

ED— I wasn’t! I was always a weirdo though. I think I always had ideas but didn’t know how to communicate them until I was much much older. I pretty much only skated from 10 until 12 years old, and then didn’t start again until I was 16. I was just a little dork playing video games all day. I’m still a little dork though. I was super antisocial at that time, then when I was 16 I started going out and making friends, going to shows. The shows really got me out of my shell. But mostly I just skated and didn’t do much else until I got hurt badly the first time when I was 18. Then I had to develop other hobbies. I wanted to find other ways to express myself. So I just tried out stuff to see what I liked. A few have stuck with me over the years.

EFRON wears UNDERWEAR by ARAKS, BELT by DIESEL

EFRON wears BRALETTE by ARAKS, SUNGLASSES by BALENCIAGA

PS— Wait, to quickly go back to video games; have you seen how gamers’ bodies are supposed to deform over time? There was some prediction about how their heads will have a dent from the headphones and their backs are supposed to be all crooked from leaning towards the computer, etc? And some gamers actually buzzed their heads and found the dents! So fucking disturbing.

ED— Wow. I’m thankful I avoided that phase.

PS— Lol, right? Tell me about your experience with modeling and the fashion world.

ED— Oh my god. About two years ago, this casting director DMed me and asked me to do a shoot. I didn’t respond for a bit then hit him back and he asked me to send him a picture of me in my underwear. And so I asked if he wanted me to wear a bra and he was like, “Why would you do that?” Like, “Because I have boobs.” He didn’t realize I was trans. He was like, “Oh my god. I’m so sorry” … Side note, I didn’t grow up thinking I’d be doing this; it wasn’t in the cards for me. So I’m like, “Why the fuck is this dude hitting me up? Is he even a real casting director? Like, what the fuck is a casting director?” Anyways, the first real experience I had with modeling was when Rachel [Chandler] hit me up for a shoot with Jim Goldberg. That was the best. I met a lot of people on that shoot, Zara [Mirkin] and Bobby at Supreme — people I’d get to know over the next few years. I didn’t understand how interconnected everything was in New York. But, yeah, overall I’ve had a good experience in that world. It’s a fun job and I’ve got people I trust looking out for me.

PS— I’m really happy to hear you have a good support system. It’s pretty wild sometimes to realize how interconnected things really are. Someone could be an asshole to you one day and 10 years later they’re the person in charge of a big project you’re working on. You never know. You have to keep your head. Striking that balance is key.

ED— I’ve had to bite my tongue, but I’ve gotten a lot better at sticking up for myself recently.

PS— That’s good. You also walked Marni recently! That’s so exciting.

ED— It’s pretty trippy. I’m lucky to be able to do it. I like to be a character in somebody’s world. The creative director has cool ideas. When I used to play music I would get the same rush, the same kick out of it. Right before I go, I get butterflies and I can’t talk. But then after, it's a release and it feels really good.

PS— You made music?

ED— I used to be in a few bands in Philly. Nowadays, I just finger pick on the guitar by myself. I used to do this thing too sometimes where I read poetry and my friend played upright bass over it. I want to bring that back.

PS— The DIY/punk scene here is pretty quiet these days. There used to be so many more experimental venues, a thriving community.

ED— Yeah, it’s hard for cool spaces to last here. Chaos Computer just closed and there are only so many other community-run spaces. But they exist and shows happen a lot. Like, there's been some pretty sick shows recently.

EFRON wears BODYSUIT by NORMA KAMALI, BELT by DIESEL, JACKET by NINA RICCI, SHOES by MAISON ERNEST, SUNGLASSES by BALENCIAGA

PS— Tell me again about the speech impediment you had when you were young and how your mum just happens to be a therapist and helped heal you?

ED— When I was really young, my mom was the speech pathologist at my school. I would do all these mouth exercises for my speech impediment. I couldn't say “sh” or “r” or “L”. Like if I said “really”, it would sound like “weewee.”

PS— I ran into Bill [Strobeck] the other night and told me to ask you some weird questions. I had no idea what to ask you, that's weird.

ED— The only example I gave Bill was like fucking …

PS— [Laughs] Do you want to talk about fucking?

ED— Actually no, that’s just kind of a joke! I don’t know, I wanted it to be raunchy haha. I’ve only done so many interviews, but I regret doing them all. You’re just always in the present and maybe I just want to exist as that present self. Sometimes you read stuff you said before and it’s funny to have your honest answers out there that maybe have changed.

PS— I get that for sure. But some of the most inspiring things I’ve come across have been Q&As, no matter how long ago they were done. People, when they’re deep in a good conversation, can lend some really pivotal advice, perspectives. It’s cool to contribute for others to take from.

ED— You're right.

PS— Tell me a fun story.

ED— There was a reading at William Burroughs’ bunker a few weeks ago and my friends and I snuck into what I believe to be Mark Rothko’s old studio. We just danced around and filmed silly videos. The walls had paint splattered all over. It was really cute — wait didn’t Burroughs kill somebody?

PS— Yeah, he shot his wife Joan Vollmer in the head accidentally.

ED— Oh yeah, I had a vague memory of reading that on Wikipedia. When I first started reading poetry I was like 17 and my first books I liked were Jack Kerouac’s Scattered Poems and Mexico City Blues. I’m not into that stuff much anymore, but was super inspired by that because they were the only poetry books I had, plus Richard Hell and Patti Smith early on. I still want to get “YOU MAKE ME _____” tattooed even though it’s kinda, ya know … It would be good, right on my rib. Kind of sexy.

PS— You should do it.

ED— So, I met this person in a poetry class before I dropped out. We would hang out all the time and write together. They would critique my poems. It was awesome. They showed me a lot of the poets I’m still really into today. Oh, speaking of, I saw Eileen Myles biking down 7th Street the other day. I was biking the wrong way down the street and I needed to get in and she let me. As I did, I saw who she was and was like, “Oh my god! I am such a big fan!” She kept on biking and yelled back, “Thank ya!” I biked for maybe 30 feet more and then stopped my bike and just started crying. I’d just read an interview with her from Butt Magazine a few days before. Seeing her in person after, just existing, I don’t know why I cried. I couldn’t contain myself. The only celebrity — celebrity to me — that I’ve ever fanned out on like that.

PS— I interviewed Lydia Lunch a while back. We met at a bar and spoke for a few hours. That was really trippy. Back to the Beat Generation, it’s cool that you’re into it. I feel like youth appreciation for that era is waning.

ED— People who write, they probably know who a lot of those people are, but most people probably have no idea. Not that it matters.

PS— Why do you think that is?

ED— I think people don’t read as many books. So they’re not going to know a writer over a TikToker.

EFRON wears COAT, SHOES by RICK OWENS, BIKINI by HEAVEN BY MARC JACOBS

EFRON wears BRA by CHRIS HABANA, PANTS by STELLA MCCARTNEY, SHOES by GIANVITO ROSSI

PS— Same with great filmmakers.

ED— Yeah, but there definitely are a lot of people who know who Wong Kar-wai and Jim Jarmusch are. I’m just into movies because I’ve been injured a lot and my old roommate was a film major, and so was this guy who I used to see. So they were always putting on really good films. Especially now, people are only shown what their algorithm provides. Some people forget that there’s more media to take in than what’s on the Internet. You can read a book; you can go see a film.

PS— Yeah, or even just go down a Wikipedia hole.

ED— Literally I’ll be up at five in the morning, on Wikipedia reading about some random person. You can just nerd out on some poet. It’s fun to look up someone you’re influenced by and read all of their interviews too. But yeah, I need to get away from the computer though. I don’t go in nature nearly enough. I need to clear my head.

PS— I’ve been spending a lot of this summer in the woods. I love taking mushrooms outside, around trees.

ED— I like taking mushrooms, but I just want to feel them — I don’t like to take too much or I get paranoid. Maybe if I take them in the woods I’ll have a better time. I don’t know why I always have them in a party setting.

PS— I want to hear more about the poetry you write.

ED— I actually made a little poetry book recently. My friend Maya [Greenberg] did all the drawings in it. I wanted to make something to put out into the world. Poems just sit there, might as well do something with them.

PS— What do you write about?

ED— Well I never used to write love poems, and I used to not like them. I wanted to read other shit. But this book is all love poems. I’m more romantic now than I used to be … Well I’m also kind of smitten right now and I just upped my estrogen. So super lovey dovey in my feels.

PS— Ah, I love! How’s dating been?

ED— I’m such a romantic. I don’t know. Up and down. I love a gentleman, kinda messy. It’s so hot, so sexy. I know a few good gentlemen … Have you listened to old Beastie Boys, when they were a hardcore band?

PS— No!

ED— They were so sick. [Puts it on] The punk scene is pretty cool here, all across the east coast there are sick bands. I miss playing music. My friend asked me to sing in a band recently. We have to get things together and write some songs. But I do want to just skate a lot right now. Music you can do forever — not that I’m old, but skating you can’t do forever. I got hurt initially two years ago and it took 11 months to heal. And then I could only skate for seven months before I got hurt again. I had a second surgery the day after this shoot and now I’m pretty much healed. I haven’t really been able to skate much these past two years. So I’m excited to do that. And there’s a really cute queer skate scene in Oakland. I want to go there again soon and skate.